I shipped some books via Media Mail in February. Buyer wrote wondering were they are. I checked and discovered the shipping address didn't match the Paypal address (in the email notification).

This is a bit complicated, so please bear with me.

The shipping label has the buyer's correct name and zip code (in NY), but everything else -- the street, the city, and the state (in Iowa) -- are wrong.

At first, I thought I had somehow mixed his address with that of some other buyer, but when I filtered for All Invoices and ran Record:Finds on the street name and city, nothing other than this transaction came up. Then he informed me the street, city, and state on the address label were his former address -- a house that burned down in 2003!

Now we are just waiting so see if this package gets returned to me (the Post Office doesn't seem to be willing to say whether the pkg would go to the zip code or to the street/city/state, and I sure do wish the clerk had noticed the disconnect, but we were probably both chatting away), but I'm curious to know how you think this could have happened.

The buyer claims he updated his eBay and Paypal contact info years ago, and the auction page does indeed show his current NY zip code. I'm mystified as to why I didn't capture the address from the Paypal notification like I always do! Did he email an address -- maybe with an old signature file -- and I used that, then deleted that email?? I cannot find any email that supports this mixed-up address. And even if I could, how would I get the zip code right and all the rest wrong (I virtually never just type addresses into the fields -- always copy-paste)?

So I thought perhaps he had bought something from me before, and when I got the Paypal notification, highlighted the address, clicked to save it, got the pop-up asking if I wanted to replace the existing address (existing because he was a customer once before), I said No.......but if that's what happened, the whole address would have been his old one, including the zip code. And besides, I purged records about 6 months ago, long after he says his house burned down, so AW would not have even recognized him as a previous customer, right?

Does anyone have any idea how this could happen? I mean I know how it could happen if the buyer sent me the mixed-up address, but is there some way it could happen by AW program error or Paypal glitch? I just can't fathom how on earth I would have his 4-years-outdated street, city, and state if the buyer didn't give them to me!

Thanks, Sue

Sue,

My word, that is a mess indeed.

AW2K remembers buyers even if records are archived. The tables that store buyer information are not the ones that are archived. So it is completely possible the buyer's old information pulled up when you generated invoices. Then if you copy and paste, maybe everything but the zip code were changed. If you are like me, If I have an interruption during a task, sometimes I dont remember where I left off.

The package will probably come back to you. Or you will get a dead package notice. I wonder if your Post Master would contact the Post Office in both towns and see if the package has come through.

How do you make up shipping labels? Do you process them using Endicia, etc? Or print them from AW2K? Or hand do them? As it is possible, if you use Endica, or Stamps.com, even Paypal to process labels and you copy/paste info or type information, maybe you looked at the AW2K records for the name, addy and when you got to the zip code you looked at the Paypal payment for that?

If you don't use Endicia or something else that verifies addresses, you might consider running all addresses through the UPS find zip. At least you'll know the full address for the buyer is really a real address.

I sure hope the package shows up. Let us all know!

Judy/blue

I think you've got this figured out. I had no idea AW could "remember" an archived shipping address. So he must have purchased something four years ago. Now, I have to fes up to him -- aaarrrrrghhhhh. I was so hoping this was his fault.

I get the zip codes from the eBay auction page (for the sake of taxable/non-taxable and to figure the total due if it's going to be calculated shipping), and I get the addresses from the Paypal email or from the buyer's email. I must have done exactly what you suggested -- copied/pasted all but the zip.

I use AW to generate & print the labels (also use Click'n'Ship, but only for Priority).

"I wonder if your Post Master would contact the Post Office in both towns and see if the package has come through."

I'll ask him. Already spoke to someone at the Iowa PO. The buyer tells me his town is so tiny that his own PO in NY would definitely have contacted him had they seen this mixed-up address.

Thanks, Judy, for figuring this out. Now, can you also get me out of the hot water I'm in? I think it's time to eat some crow and offer a refund.

P.S. It occurs to me I shoulda known AW doesn't "forget" archived addresses, because occasionally, an email and shipping address pop into the Buyer fields after an Update, and I think, "Oh, repeat buyer!" I try to find what they earlier bought from me to no avail. So I guess the rest of the transaction data is archived, but the email/shipping is still there.

Thanks again, Sue

Sue,

Yep AW2000 remembers buyers forever Which I like real well. Buyers think I have such a good memory. Little do they know it isn't me, but Aw2K! And I am not telling

Have you considered checking or verifying addresses prior to printing labels at the USPS? The zip code locator will give you the address that is registered with the USPS so at least you have one leg to stand on.

Well, I am not sure I would jump right into refund yet. I would contact the Post Offices in both town first and see if anyone has seen the package. Your Post Master should be able to assist you a bit.

However, in the end if the package doesn't show up, you might have to give him his money back. Bites doesn't it!!

Judy/blue

Sue:

Wow, you sure have a head scratcher there. I too usually cut and paste and so far haven't had a similar problem. I use a Dymo LabelWriter to print addresses. But before I print any address even one that is a repeat address I run it through a program called Address Fixer - something Judy talked about.

I've tried to fool it and so far haven't been able to do it. If the address isn't correct it won't come back to you. It will come up as an Invalid Address. The other thing that it does is make sure every line in the address is correct. If someone gives you something like 7 elm sTrEEt lot 15 the program will change it to 7 Elm St Trl 15. It also changes to the proper upper or lower case on a name or city. Once you get the correct or corrected address it has a button where you click to copy to clipboard and then it's easy to paste where ever you need it.

The tiny program is a stand alone program and I just have it in my tray waiting to use it. It came with a Dymo Labelwriter. Let me know if you're interested and I'll try to find where you can download it.

Let's hope you don't have to give a refund. Have you though of trying to trace the package on line? Or didn't it have delivery confirmation? Most Postal Employees will try however, to work with you to find the package. I've had their help a few times especially on packages going to Europe. Maybe there's not a lot that can be done but they will try.
Have you thought of calling the Post Office in Iowa?

Good luck

Garry

Hi Garry,

I just downloaded Address Fixer (free from the Dymo site). Will install later. Thanks for the tip.

I filed a "document" by phone yesterday and got a call from the Iowa PO, but the guy said the report was wrong (had me as the intended recipient), and that I was supposed to be contacted by my local PO. I called them and was told I'd have to wait at least another couple weeks before I could submit Form 1510 (because Media Mail is so slow). And no, there was no tracking added to the package. I leave that up to the buyer unless it's Priority and I'm getting the DC free via Click'n'Ship.

Maybe the Address Fixer will also help with addresses Click'n'Ship gags on. Happens about 1 in 10 times -- just doesn't like some way the street address is written and I can't proceed without calling the 800 number (usually when I've got 10 minutes to get to the PO!).

Thanks, Sue

Yes, bites. But at least this buyer doesn't seem to be flying off the handle.....yet.

Sue

Sue,

I use Endicia to process postage. And we really like the address verification. Has been quite handy. But we used the Address verifier before that. I really liked it. I bet you will be downright pleased with it as well as finding it very helpful.

Let us all know how it works out. I am going to ask my shipping clerk for some ideas. She is a whizz at finding packages in the USPS system.

Judy/blue

Sue,
I don't have any answers but I wanted to give you some encouragement from a past transaction. Years ago I sold a book, sent it media mail and the buyer never got it. We jumped through as many loops as possible and never located the book. Weeks after I received the "packaging" back in the mail. No book. I had to explain to the customer what was going on and asked them how they wanted the refund. Get this, their reply was there is no need for the refund, thanks for the great customer service, your effort is to be commeded!!! And to top it off they gave me positive feedback!
So there is hope and not every soul out there goes ballistic!

It was kind of like someone giving me a test to see what I would do in the situation.

Sometimes every thing works out and I hope it does for you too!

On another note, just last week Paypal had messed with a buyers address and gave me an old address. Fortunately the buyer realized this before I shipped the item. So maybe it did come from PayPal.

Anyway, hang in there and maybe you will have a GREAT story to tell!

Marty
Moonstruck22

Marty,

That is a great story!!! And I am glad you shared it with all of us. It's a reminder that not all buyers are ugly acting.

Judy/blue

Sue:

Great, I'm glad you found it. I think you'll like it. It is fast and easy and darn accurate also. It will correct those miss typed addresses - so far I haven't found it gagging on anything. Now it would have gagged on the address you used because there was no such address. But it would have given you a fighting chance to see what was wrong rather than just go and mail the package.

Good luck on your help from the Post Office - they should be able to tell you what's happening. Maybe, just maybe, they will get it to your customer.

Garry

Just a brief critique of Dymo's Address Fixer.

I tried it on two addresses, one a current buyer who included a lot of punctuation, and the other the mixed-up address that started this discussion.

Original:

B. Buyer
68-64 Yellowstone Blvd, Apt A-20
Forest Hills, NY 11375

Fixed:

B. Buyer
6864 Yellowstone Blvd Apt A20
Forest Hills, NY 11375-3385

As you can see, the Fixer removed the hyphen in this person's street address, which is a problem, it seems to me. 68-64 (I wonder why it's not 64-68) is a range of addresses, like when two or three row houses get remodeled into one (?), whereas 6864 would be hundreds of blocks away.

When I entered the crazy mixed-up address, the Fixer replaced the New York zip code with the correct one in Iowa but did not detect that the address, according to the buyer, doesn't exist (burned down in 2003).

So the jury is still out on Address Fixer. Do you trust it in every case, Garry?

I'm going to try Judy's suggestion of the UPS address checker when I have a chance.

Sue

Sue,

You know, it is totally possible that the buyer's address from the burned down place does have a building or residence on it now. After 4 years, more than likely someone has built on it. So the address could be valid. Just a thought.

Let me know how the USPS zip code checker thing works out for you. I can tell you that Endicia moves the addresses around like what you have described in the example

Judy/blue

Hi Marty,

For some reason I didn't get the email notice of your post, so I'm glad I came back and read the two recent ones.

I loved your story. I've had many similar situations where people have been more patient and understanding than you come to expect from all the nasties.

My buyer seems to be one of the good guys, so I don't think I'm cruisin' for a bruisin'.

Interesting about Paypal giving the wrong address. Good to know it's possible. I wonder if they were updating the site and sent erroneous/old info for a while.

Sue

You're absolutely right. I just took the buyer's word that there was no such address (like maybe he's still in touch with his old neighbors), but maybe he is just assuming.

Ok, in your first reply, you said the UPS zip code checker. Was that a typo? I thought you were using some address checker at UPS, not USPS. Do you just mean the USPS page where you put in a zip code and it gives you the city and state?

Sue

Sue,

Yes it was a typo. Geez I am so sorry.

Judy/blue

Oh, Judy. You don't need to aplogize. It was no big deal.
You help people on this board so often and so well, you'd have to make a gazillion typos and foobars for anyone to get mad at you.
Sue

Sue,

Gee. Thank you very much. How kind.

BUT-- I really am sorry

Judy/blue

Sue:
What you are experiencing with Address Fixer is what eveyone else does at first. Address FIXER fixes the address to the Standardized USPS Addressing System. I'm thinking that 6468 is the correct street address where 64-68 is a typo. If it is a large apt. building then there would be an apt number after it and in this case there is A20. BUT if they don't want a "-" in an address it is removed. The rational is that the addresses for appartments etc will all be formatted the same A20 not A 20 or or Apt # A 20 or A-20 well you get the idea.

If a place has burned down, it still has an address. Sorry that's not meant to be a smart comment - but as far as the postal service is concerned when you build a new business house there it is the same address. So that's why the local post office doesn't report that info to a national database.

I've used that database a lot of years and have yet to have a problem - so yea, I do trust it every time. It hasn't let me down yet. What Judy was refering to is using the same database and should make the exact same changes. The Dymo thingie just puts a front end on it that can be used.

Hope it helps - let me know how your tests go

Garry

Judy & Sue:

Not to worry I had a customer that sent back an irate email to me replying to the invoice I had sent - they demanded why I wasn't shipping to them UPPS. Everyone she buys from uses that because it is less expensive and if I am trying to rip her off she will report me to eBay.

After several back and forth emails I finally got the bright idea to type out USPS in words and she said "well, sir, yes that is what I wanted and if you typed it correctly in your first email this wouldn't have happened". I guess she always thought the Postal Service was UPPS.

Garry

Would you believe I have two buyers whose stuff will ship today, both with hypenated address numbers?

I've written to them to see if these are typos or if the numbers without the hyphens would create confusion or go to a totally different location on the same street.

Will let you know.

Interesting topic (for AW nerds like us ).

Sue

Sue.

'Aint' that the truth!

My kids call me "geek" and things like that. I mean my idea of a good conversation is discussing Listing templates, AW2K features and the guts in my computer I just built

Judy/blue

I heard back from my hypenated buyers.

One address was

37-02
Apt 3

and the other was

68-64
Apt A 20

I asked them if using the numbers without the hyphens would cause confusion, and they both said it would be no problem either way. I can only assume this means there is no address on their streets with such high numbers as would seem to be indicated without the hyphens.

So there ya go. Clear as mud, huh? What's the point of a hyphen if it doesn't matter? I don't like fuzzy whateverness.

Sue

Sue,

Now that is weird. You would think that there would be a huge difference between 3702 and 37-02. I mean that could be miles apart, literally.

How in the world does the USPS ever come up with some of the addresses I will never know. We have a building whose address is 720-1/2 Main. Now how do you get a 1/2 building. Geez, I have never had the appraiser charge me half Real Estate taxes on the 1/2 address. They want the whole shabang!

Judy/blue

It's not so much the Post Office coming up with the strange numbers as some local government. Typically the street numbers are assigned every so many feet--30, 60, whatever. If you knew the number and the increment, you'd know how far from some central point the place is. Those half numbers occur when there's more than one building within the increment.

Ned

Ned,

I just trotted over and asked our mayor how in the world our house number is 100 when we are the only place on the road and why our building which takes up half a city block has a 1/2 number. (You see, the "mayor" is my hubby. He keeps trying to get me to refer to him as "Your honor" NOT!!

And you know what, that booger assigned our house number when we built the place. Didn't even ask me what house address I wanted, just picked it out. And the "mayor" had the nerve to tell me he had that authority and I didn't so he didn't ask me

In all seriousness, he said the way our city does it, they do work with the local Post Office but they also use the county plats, check where properties lay within a section and that is how the numbers are assigned. I honestly didn't know the city governments assigned addresses. I thought the Post Office did it and notified the city.

Why you can teach an old dog new tricks

Judy/blue

Judy:
Here (Florida) the Power Company assigns numbers to buildings. It is based on (I Think) the pole numbers and or the transformer numbers. Our number is 5262. The numbers on one side jump four at a time so on either side of us is 5258 and 5266. But just like any other town or city the numbers repeat on another street obviously. The Postal Service doesn't have anything to do with numbering here. It is an easy system in urban sprawl and makes it easier for Police and Fire. I've never seen a 1/2 number but that doesn't make it impossible. Also the same system is used in some areas of New York state that I'm aware of.

Garry

Garry,

Remember we live in Mayberry RFD. Where if you send a letter to Pennyworth in Columbus, KS, well, it will get there just fine. That is pretty interesting how you all get your addresses. I bet every community has their own rhyme and reason to it.

Judy/blue

Just letting you guys know this package was finally returned to me almost three months after I shipped it Media Mail. It had never made it to the New York post office -- the location indicated by the zip code. As soon as it arrived in Iowa, someone crossed out the NY zip, so there was no way anyone could have even tried that location. Lesson is, I guess, the city/state trumps the zip code when they don't match.

There were stamps indicating they left notices at the old, burned-down address in Iowa, but eventually they gave up on the addressee ever coming in to pick it up and shipped it back to the sender.

The box was a mess. It had been opened and resealed very poorly, and the airbag inside was missing (the contents were undamaged, though). I patched it up and resent it wrapped in brown paper so the buyer could see the box's condition. And get this.....he reversed my refund! Very nice person. When I reshipped, I said repayment wasn't necessary, but that I'd appreciate having the shipping cost reimbursed. But he sent the whole payment again. Happy ending.

Sue

Sue,

That is a happy ending.

Can you believe how long it takes?? Three months. I'm just glad you got it worked out. That is cool!

Judy/blue

Sue:
Wow 3 months but it got there finally. Guess that's why it is called snail mail. Your customer really came through by reversing the refund - not every customer would have done that. Also Sue, you did yourself proud by making sure the customer was served. Congratulations on solving the mystery and thanks for letting us know the outcome.

Garry